Monday, April 29, 2024

Death Battle Predictions: Dr. Coyle vs Moira


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"One general law, leading to the advancement of all organic beings, namely, multiply, vary, let the strongest live and the weakest die." ― Charles Darwin

Dr. Coyle, the genetic manipulating ‘rad scientist’ from ARMS.

Moira, the moral-defying Minister of Genetics from Overwatch.

Science is the fundamental understanding of our world, how one can figure out the truth behind common events in nature and the uncommon truth of the unnatural. With that idea, there might seem to be no reason to do truly anything to progress one’s research and conception of the world. However, when morals line up against science, it’s more often a safe approach to follow societal expectations than oppose them in the name of science… 
However, these two geneticists are a great example of what to expect when one loses all bounds in respect and expectation when they become insane enough to do anything to progress their understanding in the name of a better humanity. Yet despite the self-mutilation they’ve done to themselves, they’ve got a few more things under their ‘sleeves’ to prove their insanity comes with a conscious strength. And with this much research, all that’s left is for these two scientists going head-to-head to test their biological hypothesis in a DEATH BATTLE!

Before We Start

Both characters are given their general lore and feats, including cutscenes, gameplay, and ARMS promotional and concept art for Coyle, while including cutscenes, comics, extended media, and PvE for Moira. However, due to the nature of Overwatch and its lore, gameplay and scaling that would come from it will be ignored for extensive reason (such as the verbatim intention to not interfere with lore) although it wouldn’t change much here.

Background

Dr. Coyle


Welcome to the world of ARMS: For millennia, the world has always had ties to the power of spirals, springs, and all things twisted. In particular, every biological being has one particular gene that can be passed down known merely as the ARMS trait, stemming from humans to plants to wildlife. However, due to this genes workings, the ability will constantly swap around uncontrollably, harming those with the ability. With this in mind, a group of scientists at the newly founded ARMS Foundation created masks that could be used to control the users biology and control their arms without harming themselves in the process. However, with certain people going to the most extreme measures, perhaps there are people who’d willingly hurt themselves to progress humanity… In this regard, meet Dr. Coyle, the biggest and baddest brain from the ARMS Lab.

Being the very head of the ARMS laboratories, such a helpful place must pay a price to have such an evil woman as their leader- which comes at a price, of course. While the laboratories have countless helpful modern additions to technology, Coyle herself is a true evil who only wishes to progress humanity and obtain power. With this intention, she’s gone to measures like biologically mutating her subjects, creating mind-altering devices, and taking revenge on those she has a particular distaste for- the usual for an evil scientist like herself.


With her ill intentions, Coyle has gone to such an extreme way to become the strongest ARMS fighter. Not only is she the first and only biologically manipulated ARMS wielder, an attribute that alone shows how willing she is to follow suit with her goals, but she’s gone out of her way to create evil clones of her rivals and pure evil machines bent on domination and control all in the name of progress. After all, progress cannot be achieved without sacrifice, and a sacrifice… she is willing to make.


Moira

A scientist contained by morality of the world, Moira O’Deorain was a high profile yet similarly highly criticized scientist that many targeted out of jealousy and particular hatred- being from the fact that Moira was far too skilled for anyone in her league. Having her genetic manipulation being a unique skill to her own that no other scientist could replicate alongside her controversial ideology of DNA caused her to looked down upon people who attempted to silence her - including the heroic organization known as Overwatch. However, she would be silently brought into the grips of Overwatch’s subgroup known as Blackwatch, a special black ops hidden by Overwatch that took hired mercenaries and known criminals - seemingly included Moira into this idea.  


Despite the obvious distaste, Moira found her place here in Blackwatch– Yet, as the group continued its work, obvious public outrage stirred from the forming of it of which would get even worse when a Blackwatch invasion against Talon resulted in the death of Antonio Bartolotti, a well-respected in the public, but evil in the shadows, businessman alongside the death of numerous other Talon agents in the mission. While Talon was evil, the public still beared arms against the idea of a secret forces trying to hide away, with the outrage from the public simply overwhelming Overwatch and forcing the disbandment of Blackwatch’s unit. 


However, Moira would not quit. Needing the funds for her project, she worked soon with Talon after the collapse of Blackwatch. Working with the group, she supported the biological mutations of tools like Widowmaker and, soon after Overwatch’s collapse in itself, Gabriel Reyes, now known as Reaper. Aligned with a group that valued her ideals of bringing forward a new step of humanity without requiring the moral high ground other scientists required, Moira continued her work into the lines of genetic manipulation in order to bring great revelations to the world of biology and genetics.With Moira freed from the shackles of society, she’s willing to do anything to strengthen humanity- and even further, build a new world with the power in her hands.

Skill and Experience


Dr. Coyle

Dr. Coyle is an immensely skilled scientist capable of performing numerous feats of intellect, such as creating Hedlok, a mind-control device only she can resist which empowers a user and their ARMS, or the Cell, hundreds of subservient DNA creatures she can use to do her bidding. Most importantly, Coyle has created intelligent AI like with Springtron, indirectly formed Helix, a Cell that gained sentience away from Coyle however still follows her actions, and raised Master Mummy from the dead as her minion. However, Coyle is not only scientifically impressive but also impressive in regards to combat, having taken down Max Brass who was the reigning champion of ARMS tournaments for years, as well as creating an entirely new form of combat in her world through her deceit and intelligence with Party Matches in order to progress her understanding of ARMS. With Coyle being obsessed with ARMS ever since she was young, she’s no slack in her comprehension of them, being the leading scientist in ARMS to have created the masks that empower everyone, allowing them to control their… arms… as well as being the only person across history to have been able to physically replicate the ARMS genetic structure without failing.

Moira

Moira is a powerful, cunning, and almost magical genetic scientist, having been responsible for the creation of a biological project that no other scientist in her field could recreate when she released her studies on cellular recreation. In addition, her skill has brought her to- less than fame- particularly due to her lack of innate morals when it comes down to intention. However, this has taken nothing away from her skill when she was both a potent combatant and genetic researcher in her time on Blackwatch despite her presumed rivalry against other scientists such as Angela Ziegler, also known as Mercy. Moira has similarly been inducted as the Ministry of Biology when she joined Talon, taking place in its inner circle due to her skill, intelligence, and knowledge. She’s gone to the extent of crafting monstrous warriors like Reaper with her cellular manipulation, and has even performed the same on herself, presumably being responsible for the idea of and wielding biotic energy in combat.

Equipment

Dr. Coyle

ARMS 

Dr. Coyle, as an ARMS user, is capable of wielding a wide variety of ARMS each with unique powers and types. Not only can Coyle swap between them but she can combo between any ARMS, allowing her to have a great deal of versatility in combat.

  • Biffler: A Blinding ARM that wields stamps, obscuring the opponents vision with a big stamp on their face when hit.

  • Blorb: A sticky blue orb that Coyle can throw around, blinding her opponent when it hits them.

  • Boomerang: A Curve-type ARM with the Wind attribute allowing it to create cyclones to attack opponents when charged up.

  • Brrchuck: An Ice attribute nunchuck which creates freezing cyclones.

  • Bubb: A boxing glove that can buff up in size when charged.

  • Buff: Similar to Bubb however wields increased homing.

  • Chakram: A quick curving Curve-type ARM with the Stun attribute which can paralyze opponents when hit.

  • Chilla: A frozen boxing glove that hit sub-zero temperatures, allowing to hit negative temperatures in Rush mode to freeze opponents. 

  • Clapback: A Shield ARM that can block any blow from an opposing ARM, normally deflecting blows when shot out but being able to charge enemy attacks when Clapback itself is charged.

  • Coolerang: A Curve-type ARM with the Ice attribute that can flash freeze opponents, being able to create a Wind attributed tornado in Rush mode.

  • Cracker: A birthday popper themed ARM with the Fire attribute, shooting out miniature stars with its projectile. Due to having the Fire attribute, it can set enemies on fire.

  • Dragon: A Beam-type ARM that’s nearly 4,000 years old, having a chargeable laser that sets enemies on fire.

  • Funchuck: A Stun attributed nunchuck which can stun enemies.

  • Glusher: A magenta bouncy orb ARM that can explode and poison enemies when charged. 

  • Guardian: A Shield-type ARM that can block any types of ARMS regardless of their weight.

  • Homie: A homing missile ARM that auto-targets and explodes on its own, 

  • Hydra:A projectile ARM with the Fire attribute which shoots three projectiles, particularly better when used against opponents due to its vertical height.

  • Ice Dragon: a 4,000 year old Beam-type ARM with the Ice attribute, allowing it to freeze enemies in its tracks, increasing in power as it’s charged up.

  • Kablammer:A Hammer-type ARM with the Explosive attribute originally designed for tearing down buildings, homing in on the nearest target and slamming down on them.

  • Lokjaw: Dr. Coyle’s self-made ARM with the Explosion attribute, launching explosions at her opponents who’s Rush power allows it to fire a gigantic fireball.

  • Megaton: A large, heavy metallic sphere which Coyle can throw forward with immense force yet slow speed. 

  • Megawatt: A large, heavy metallic sphere which Coyle can throw forward with immense force yet slower speed. Due to it’s Electric attribute, this ARM is able to deactivate an opponent’s ARM or generally any other technology on their person.

  • Nade:A boxing glove styled ARM with the explosive trait that has the slowest movement speed, however wields the highest power. Due to lacking an innate guidance system, it must be controlled directly by Coyle. 

  • Parabola: Another one of Dr. Coyle’s innate ARMS which is an Umbrella-type ARM with the Electric attribute which can open at a longer distance.

  • Parasol: An Umbrella-type ARM with the Wind attribute which can open at a longer distance. Due to it’s Wind attribute, it can knock opponents back.

  • Phoenix: A Curve-type ARM with the Fire attribute which can loop around and travel omnidirectionally. 

  • Popper: A multi-shot ARM in the style of a Birthday popper, wielding the Wind attribute. 

  • Ramram: A Curve-type ARM in the style of a Chakram with the Fire attribute, having the ability to ‘thouroughly char’ opponents with flames.

  • Retorcher: A revolver that was made in the wrong way, now acting as an ARM with the Fire attribute. 

  • Revolver: A multi-shot ARM that fires three electrified shots who’s Rush mode will constantly send out projectiles.

  • Roaster: A boxing glove ARM with the Fire attribute that lacks manual control, leading to it being stronger than normal. 

  • Scorpio: A unique type of ARM with the Poison attribute, being able to dislodge itself from the ARMS unit and onto opponents, poisoning and attacking them. 

  • Seeky: A missile ARM with the Electric attribute that seeks out opponents, dealing more damage the farther that they travel.

  • Skully: A unique ARM stripped down its skeleton, targeting opponents at a high speed and poisoning them in a single blow.

  • Slamamander: An ARM in the style of a whipping hand that wields the Wind attribute. 

  • Slapamander: An ARM in the style of a whipping hand that wields the Fire attribute. 

  • Sparky: An electrified boxing glove ARM that can shock and disable enemies due to its Electric attribute. 

  • Thunderbird: A Curve-type ARM in the style of a bird with the Electric attribute that can move omnidirectionally. 

  • Toaster: A boxing glove ARM with the Fire attribute.

  • Triblast: A multi-shot ARM with the Explosive attribute that shoots out three projectiles with explosive potential.

  • Tribolt: A multi-shot ARM with the Electric attribute that shoots out three projectiles with shocking potential.

  • Whammer: A hammer ARM with the Stun attribute originally meant for construction, homing in on opponents and smashing down on them.

Item Drones

Coyle can use four different items in her fights, dropped in by item drones or knocked out of their hold. However, item drones may also serve other purposes such as bringing new ARMS or bringing balls. These four different items include:


  • HP Juice: Juice that heals Coyle and others in an AoE when dropped.

  • Gauge Juice: Juice that charges up Coyle’s guage meter and others in an AoE when dropped.

  • Fire Bomb: A bomb that explodes into a massive boom, hitting any opponents in the vicinity.

  • Electric Shock Bomb: A bomb that explodes into an AoE electricity blast that stuns opponents, shutting down their ARMS and other devices within the vicinity.

Moira

Backbling

Moira is outfitted with a special suit which she was likely responsible for creating that allows her to channel Biotic energy throughout her body and into her hands.

Abilities

Dr. Coyle

ARMS Physiology

Coyle wields genetically modified ARMS on her body which retain similar characteristics to that of natural ARMS. These spiral ARMS can be extended from her body as an attack, she can swap between different types of ARMS each with special characteristics, and these ARMS are specially controlled by the mask she wields strengthening them. Coyle holds a special ability where she can create an extra arm from either of her pauldrons which comes from her genetic manipulation of herself.

Invisibility

Coyle can become invisible by blocking for extended periods, getting knocked down, or on her own if she needs to. She can seemingly move faster in this state, having outmaneuvered Max Brass and ‘teleported’ behind him.

Flight

Coyle constantly flies and hovers in the air, being able to constantly ascend and descend to gain mobility advantages over her opponents and attack from many angles if needed.

Rush Mode

By doing various actions like throwing out her arms, using Rush Juice, etcetera, Coyle is able to charge her Rush Gauge. In Rush, Coyle’s various ARMS have different abilities and projectiles as well as increasing her damage and the weight class of her ARMS, preventing them from being knocked around. 

Moira

Biotic Grasp

Moira can use the energy located in her suit to drain biotic energy or release it, damaging and healing enemies respectively. However, due to her biotic energy being in a limited supply, Moira cannot constantly repel it out, either allowing it to charge or absorbing it from nearby enemies.

Biotic Orb

Moira can release biotic orbs that heal or damage enemies, depending on which is used. Due to its cooldown and functioning with biotic energy, Moira can only release one at a time. These slow down when healing or damaging enemies however have a short supply of energy which can be drained overtime. Their best usage comes with environmental usage as they constantly bounce around, allowing them to be used with ‘geometrical excellence’, to say the least.

Fade

Moira can become invisible and intangible, disappearing into shadows and cleansing status effects. However, when Moira fades, she cannot attack enemies. Moira’s fade is a short-burst movement option which additionally increases her jump height when faded. However, unlike other characters like Reaper with this ability, Moira does not retain the ability to reload her biotic energy due to it being separate from herself. 

Coalescense

By charging enough energy and damage, Moira can unleash a combined attack with biotic energy in both output and input. Using this, Moira can simultaneously damage opponents and heal teammates with a biotic beam which passes through enemies. In addition, Moira can use her fade for added mobility with her ultimate at the cost of pausing her attack.

Support

Dr. Coyle

Helix

One of Coyle’s creations and her ‘baby’, Helix is an incomplete ARMS wielder who can manipulate its height and maneuver easily around the battlefield as a result, using this as its leading upper edge against opponents. Despite being weaker than expected, Helix is nonetheless a potent combatant. Similar to Coyle, Master Mummy has the ability to wield any ARMS and shares the innate ARMS physiology.

Springtron

A robot created as a clone of the original Spring Man by Dr. Coyle, Springtron is a robot who holds almost no difference to Spring Man both physically and in abilities, such as sharing Spring Man’s ability to deflect blows passively. However, an ability that sets Springtron apart from Spring Man is the ability to creature a large aura that turns off opposing attacks, disabling them for a short time. Similar to Coyle, Master Mummy has the ability to wield any ARMS and shares the innate ARMS physiology.

Master Mummy

An unfortunate soul resurrected by Dr. Coyle who wishes to see his family once again, Master Mummy is an absolute berserker and a massive heavyweight combatant. Similar to Coyle, Master Mummy has the ability to wield any ARMS and shares the innate ARMS physiology.

Hedlok

One of Coyle’s prized inventions, Hedlok. A mind control device which wields four arms, it can be used as a means to take control of combatants and fight on its own against those it hates, or Coyle herself can equip it to absolutely dominate those she opposes. 

The Cell

Coyle’s army of underlings which she uses as her subservient tools, of which she is able to use them as extra support when creating inventions or use them in a means of combat. While they can be one-shot by any fighter comparable, the Cell are more often used to overwhelm opponents with large barrages of attacks although they wield basic ARMS.

Moira

Reaper

One of Moira’s former Blackwatch teammates, formerly known as Gabriel, Reaper was genetically modified by her to become a warrior capable of turning into smoke, allowing him to transport himself across the fight. However, being consumed by pure rage has left him as nothing short of a monster on the battlefield. He wields two shotguns which he can endlessly recreate with his biology should he run out of ammo, and upon consuming himself in anger he can do what’s described as merely ‘fading through space’- in that the Reaper can perform a Death Blossom, constantly shooting all around him. This has allowed Reaper to take down opponents higher than himself in strength, such as Winston. 

Widowmaker

A genetically modified human who was married to an Overwatch operative turned into a living weapon by Talon. She wields a rifle known as the Widow’s Kiss, which can swap between acting as an automatic rifle and turn into a long-range sniper rifle when needed. She can also toss herself around the battlefield with her grappling hook and set up poisonous mines. Her ultimate allows Widowmaker to display the location of all enemies to herself and her teammates, allowing her to line up shots through being able to see in nearly every direction with her helmet alongside this. 

Sombra

Being nothing short of the most dangerous operative in Overwatch, Sombra is an elite hacker who has climbed herself up the ranks deceitfully manipulating the world behind her having no firewall she cannot bypass. Naturally wielding a sub-machine gun, Sombra is able to stealthily disappear and go invisible, place a Translocator to teleport herself out of sticky situations, hack the environment around her, and launch infectious projectiles that deal damage. Her ultimate allows her to perform a widespread hack on the area, disabling technology including weaponry, abilities, etc. 

Mauga

A Samoan warrior who was reconstructed into a cyborg after taking a devastating explosion. He dual-wields miniguns, with Gunny being able to set enemies on fire and Cha-Cha dealing extra damage to enemies set on fire. Mauga can convert critical damage to health in order to beef himself up, he can charge through enemy lines with his Overrun ability, and can heal himself and his team through Cardiac Overdrive with damage dealt. His ultimate ability allows him to set up a cage that locks in all enemies around him, preventing them from using mobile abilities in order to gun them down entirely. 

Weaknesses

Dr. Coyle

Coyle can be easily overtaken by her rage due to her god complex, wanting to become the strongest ARMS champion and empower humanity. This has left her to be taken down by lesser combatants and destroy her creations when she’s become enraged. Even further, Coyle is a combatant who plays heavily around range with a large number of her ARMS which can lead close-quarters combat tricky if this gap can be closed, making Coyle very open to counterattacks if she overextends herself. Coyle has to generally gather enough damage to open up Rush opportunities with her attacks which can prevent her from instantly leading with the ability to destroy opponents. 

Moira

Moira’s massive ego and god complex causes her to see herself as a ‘saviour’ in a way, constantly ridiculing those around her she sees herself inferior to and making sure that everything works under her hand. Due to her limited biotic energy in her system, Moira must drain it from opponents in order to recharge her limited supply. Similarly, her Biotic Orbs and the like have cooldowns, preventing her from using her abilities constantly should she intend on wasting them, with her orbs in particular having a decay time and their own charge time which can be depleted. Moira’s biggest ability in her Ultimate explicitly requires her to charge up with damage, preventing her from immediately pulling out her Coalescense against any unfortunate soul in her way.

Feats

Dr. Coyle

Overall

  • The director of ARMS Labs responsible for biological research on ARMS.

  • Formed the ARMS Party Crash operation.

  • Created Springtron, Hedlok, and Helix.

  • Resurrected Master Mummy from the dead with her biology skill.

  • Relative to Max Brass and later fought with him, the reigning Champion of ARMS for years.

  • Partly responsible for the innovation of ARMS masks which give control to ARMS.

  • Fought various characters in the ARMS tournament and in her story mode, such as Kid Cobra, Spring Man, Ribbon Girl, Twintelle, Mechanica, etcetera.

Strength

Speed

  • Able to keep up with and surpass Max Brass in speed, the Reigning ARMS champion.

  • Comparable to other fighters who can dodge Min Min’s Dragon ARM.

  • Comparable to Min Min, who can deflect incoming ARMS including Electric, Wind, and Explosion types as well as missiles.

    • Electricity can get around 560.462 m/s.

    • Explosives move at varying speeds depending on the compound and creation, reaching this speed when we calculate the average. 

  • Can keep up with Ninjara who can disappear with smoke bombs and move faster than eyesight.

  • Ninjara can move fast enough to cross an alleyway and catch a pot before it can hit a child (27 m/s) 

  • Can keep up with Springman who’s ARMS could move faster than a car, allowing him to catch a child before he can be hit.

  • Able to react to missile attacks herself, with missiles generally being able to reach up to 300 m/s.

  • Scales to Hedlok who could fly at an immense speed into the sky (Mach 3.54)

Durability

  • Can withstand blows from other characters.

  • Able to tank blows from ARMS like the Kablammer, an ARM originally meant for demolition jobs.

  • Able to match Max Brass blow-for-blow until she took him down with another hit.

  • Able to bounce back from constant Rush barrages from opponents, such as those that would create massive explosions or heavily burn an opponent.

  • Comparable to Max Brass who can withstand and deflect hits through sheer durability when flexing.

Moira

Overall

  • The Minister of Biology, as well as being the first person to develop unbeatable research regarding cellular manipulation. 

  • Former member of Blackwatch and member of Talon’s inner circle.

  • Genetically modified Reaper and Widowmaker into their current states with her skill in biology.

  • Has taken on vast numbers of opponents varying from Talon guards to omnics.

  • Presumably rivals Angela Ziegler in intelligence.

  • Due to her intelligence, Moira has become a psychopath willing to do anything to further humanity’s developments.

Strength

  • Comparable to Blackwatch agents like Cassidy who can one-shot others with his gun and physically busted through a reinforced window.

  • Fought with a large number of Talon’s units, later working together to take down one of Talon’s brutes.

    • The brute that they fought was capable of slamming into the ground at an immense speed, likely being fast enough to where it was set on fire through sheer speed (.23 tons of TNT)

  • Comparable to Talon members like Reaper or Sombra who can easily take down large numbers of enemies.

  • Comparable to Widowmaker who one-shot Tracer’s Chronal Accelerator.

Speed

Durability

Before the Verdict…

Faster Than Light Overwatch

Across Overwatch there a vast number of feats that are used to argue for Overwatch reaching faster than light which we did not use in this blog, of which we have explicit details as for why we didn’t use these, or at the very least would not be used for Moira’s stats.


Lightspeed Sombra

A common argument our teams saw was that Sombra’s EMP was categorized as moving faster than light, a fact that is simply untrue. The main premise for this is that Sombra’s EMP is an electromagnetic pulse (as the name says so) which is an AoE attack that characters such as Genji can move faster than when using abilities. However, the big problem that comes with arguing Sombra’s EMP as being one is that Sombra’s Ultimate simply doesn’t function as one. An EMP functions by destroying electronics or disrupting them heavily, generally enacting as an electromagnetic field, and enacts itself as a burst of energy. While Sombra’s EMP is displayed as a burst of energy, Sombra’s other showings do not exactly entertain this notion such as when she used it to instead hack a localized system, shutting off the lights specifically in the building that Talon occupied when in Masquerade. Not only has it not been consistently shown as a pulse, which would be the main premise of being an EMP, Sombra’s ability is explicitly described as ‘hacking’, and generally all of her abilities centralize the manipulation of technology and information even further displayed when she can manipulate data and shut down or manipulate electronics. Sombra’s EMP being classified as one simply wouldn’t make sense for her powerset and if it were a legitimate EMP would inherently harm her, and as we see both in-game and visually it acts as a widescale hack ability than an EMP attack that would specifically be considered lightspeed.


Another premise made that we saw was that Sombra has shown the ability to dodge Zarya’s Particle Cannon, which we do agree to move at lightspeed. However, in the comic itself, Sombra has only been shown to dodge her secondary fire after seeing her pull the trigger and had to keep out of Zarya’s sight to avoid her particle cannon, barraging with her attacks before she could react, getting Zarya to physically overwhelm her than try to hit an invisible target, not pushing Zarya to do so because Sombra dodged her attacks. We also just generally don’t see Sombra dodging it directly or a good reference shot where Sombra did perform a dodge on it.

While we don’t generally agree with gameplay arguments, Sombra’s arguments in particular use gameplay points to support her scaling to FTL, such as Genji being able to dodge EMP. In this context, Zarya’s primary fire can explicitly bypass abilities like D.Va's Defense Matrix or Orisa’s Javelin Spin, which works off of her reaction speed and destroys solid matter. Another supporting premise of Zarya’s legitimate FTL rating and blitzing reactions is that Sigma’s Kinetic Grasp ability, which deconstructs matter and turns it into shields, cannot affect Zarya’s particle cannon. With this, we inherently agree that Zarya’s primary fire would function at the same speed as the particle accelerator it is based on- however, we do not agree with anyone scaling to this speed as it can bypass abilities meant to block it due to speed and lack of mass. Similarly with how the rest of this blog has treated Overwatch’s in-game scaling, we have no grounds for scaling characters through actual lore in the story (there aren’t any story mode missions to base off scaling, either) to Sombra’s EMP in this way.


Generally however, if we were to take the names of abilities that are hyperbolic into usage, there are… interesting arguments to be made for Coyle’s scaling that would simply not help Moira here.

Illari’s Sunlight

Another argument generally brought up with Overwatch speed is referenced to Illari, a Support who displays abilities centralized around solar energy. While it is true that Illari’s powers are referenced as coming from the sun which emits light, Illari herself does not use anything that is truly lightspeed. As this also comes within the grounds of gameplay because Illari is in a vacuum at the moment in her lore, the same logic is applied to judge Illari’s arguments here.


For starters, Illari’s entire kit has constant usage of beams with mass, or her abilities display mass. Illari’s primary fire, for example, can be caught by Orisa’s Javelin Spin which spins fast enough to block projectiles (giving it a form of mass as it gets split apart), it can charge Sigma’s Kinetic Grasp which disassembles attacks and reforms them into shields, etc. Illari’s projectile, while a hitscan, would similarly contradict the speed ratings we’ve given to actual near lightspeed attacks like Zarya’s Particle Cannon as D.Va can specifically react to Illari’s primary fire. In addition, Illari’s Outburst which is formed by solar energy is a move that deals knockback, launching herself and enemies around, meaning that her solar energy has force. Illari’s other abilities explicitly also do not follow the same principle of lightspeed as they’re generally portrayed as magical healing abiltiies, so it’s very unlikely that they’re solar light but more so a form of energy from the sun which we know is even more likely when the same solar energy acted as a power source and Illari’s abilities like Captive Sun specifically came from the markings she was given to harness solar energy as a power. 


Even if Illari’s light was hypothetically lightspeed, as we would normally support if we ignored her abilities contradictions, her scaling is an entire vacuum at the moment to where we don’t have the slightest idea of where Illari scales. For all that we know at the moment, Illari could be the fastest character in the series, which for this reason her scaling simply shouldn’t be used to any medium. 

Vishkar’s Hard Light

Hard light is another similar premise used to support Overwatch being faster than light which has been seen before multiple times in the past by our team. This argument is less in tune with gameplay arguments and more in line with the mechanics of Overwatch, however this is also the most simple to counteract. While hard-light is a light projection, it uses photons that are manipulated in such a way that they become physically solid, given mass done by slowing them down, and then need to be bonded with carbon in order to become truly durable objects. Due to this, and various other factors such as Lifeweaver’s or Symmetra’s main usage of hard-light being completely physical, it simply isn’t usable.


Symmetra does use a Photon projector, however because at the moment she remains in a vacuum and there is no reason to scale it to any character it wouldn’t mean much.

Tracer’s Blinks and Omnic Reaction Time

While we do not have an exact disagreement with the usage of Omnics listening to music to gain perception from, our team had a few problems with how scaling would be enacted between these characters.


To start off, we do not believe that every Omnic scales to let alone has reaction time down to the microfraction of a millisecond even while we do agree with it inherently. There is an explicit difference and hierarchy between omnics with the lower an omnium’s power was, this was treated as a level above or below these omnics. Omnics created specifically during the Omnic Crisis had are inherently treated as so much lesser to newer age omnics that they simply cannot be compared. This includes characters like Bastion and even Orisa’s original frame that were seen as obsolete, which means that these omnics simply have lesser computational power and thus have no grounds for scaling, which is one of the few points as to scaling which comes from these characters. Another good point against using this is that omnics may have this form of perception time however are explicitly caught even by bullets and electricity, showing that their reaction time likely isn’t down to this insane timeframe or at the very least their physical bodies cannot react to this degree compared to data calculation, which is an absolutely fair point here alongside the common avoidance of these forms of vague perception feats. 


Beyond this, though, we generally did not agree with scaling any parties to surpassing their reactions. There aren’t any inherent examples of characters bypassing Omnic perception times without a special ability, and there are simply numerous counters both to scaling characters to reaction speed to how insane of an outlier this would be in general. However, one example that does come to mind came in the form of Tracer’s blinks which can catch Omnics off-guard and stun them, alongside statements from supportive media. While we have no particular contentions with this idea, we genuinely did not agree with any characters scaling to Tracer’s blinks besides the very tip top of the verse’s scale (which was still very contentious) that simply wouldn’t affect Moira.


This came in form of…

  • Tracer’s blinks can outspeed characters directly comparable to Moira physically and in reaction speed, such as Genji or Widowmaker.

  • Tracer’s usage of Blinks isn’t something she can react to on her own, with it speeding up her very molecules, acting as her own time so that she can accelerate how time acts for her, not exactly increasing her speed as people would argue. (hence why it can be intercepted yet we don’t agree with it scaling to reactions)

  • No one holds direct scaling to Tracer’s Blinks in their base kit, without the usage of abilities, amplfications, etc. besides one character who Moira doesn’t scale to physically who, as we agreed, to be the top dog of Talon. 


Regardless of whether or not one agrees with omnic reaction times being used in the first place, there is no grounds for Moira scaling to it. She doesn’t scale to Tracer’s Blinks, Tracer’s Blinks can outpace characters comparable to her directly, and those who could even have the notion to scale to Tracer’s Blinks are just way higher and don’t have direct scaling anyways. 

The Titan Omnic

To put it blunt, the arguments for anyone scaling to the Titan are simply unusable and we had no reason to acknowledge any potential scaling that came with it. There are several reasons as to why this is the case, however.

The Titan Omnics have been described as being a destroyer of worlds, with these similar omnics being shown to physically overwhelm the cast with ease and requiring extensive power to take them down, such as when Mei and Tracer needed to combine their abilities to solely negate the durability of one, Brigitte and Reinhardt needing to combine their shields to block an attack that overwhelmed them even so, Genji having to use his Dragonblade to cut off the Titan Omnic’s hand alone, etc. Another mission in Overwatch 2’s Story Mode displayed to us that Torbjörn’s big plan when fighting off Null Sector came with turning on his improved defense network which the Omnic Titan was still able to withstand without any issue having needed to use one of his turrets powered by the same volcanic cores at full power by redirecting it to the turret in order to actually take it down, showing that these Titan Omnics are just absolutely on a level of power that simply can’t be physically compared to the playable cast. This becomes even more so an issue with Torbjörn’s own fight in Destroyer where the only way he could do anything to combat against it, because no one else was able to in the nearby military power, was to exploit its weak internals which he could only do because he knew about its weaknesses and had to particularly take down its pilot. 


With there being no direct Titan Omnic scaling besides hyperspecific circumstances, and with Moira getting none of this scaling herself, there was no point in attempting to argue for scaling with it.

FASTER THAN LIGHT ARMS???

Maybe.

In ARMS, there exists the Electric Shock Bomb which is an electricity-based explosive that disables technology with a boom, particularly disabling technology by disrupting it in the same way that Electric ARMS do, allowing the potential for an argument to be made that these Electric Shock Bombs would be equivalent to that of a miniature electromagnetic pulse, being an explosive pulse that disables technology, deals environmental damage, etc. fitting every category for it. Whether or not you as the reader would accept it under this idea is up to you however for the sake of fairness we decided to leave this completely optional although it will be mentioned in the verdict.

Verdicts

Stats

Generally speaking, both parties were even at a first glance. Moira’s scaling came in the form of several durability feats, ranging from low kilojoules to tons of TNT through Talon and Blackwatch members, while Coyle herself came with various scaling from the cast or through feats she’d perform herself, ranging generally between low tons to exceeding half a ton of TNT. While they got in similar ballparks in general measurement, Coyle exceeded Moira statistically and at her worst was comparable. Moira’s kilojoule feats were impressive scaling to Widowmaker and the potential to scale to Pharah, reaching over 100 to 157 kilojoules, however dwarfed in comparison to Coyle’s lowest end feats such as punching Max Brass, a feat that got to 0.0022 tons of TNT- over 200 times stronger in value.


Luckily, this gap would close up as we look into higher ends, with Moira’s argument for potentially scaling to Talon Brutes getting up to 0.23 tons of TNT, and Coyle’s own higher ends. Despite this, Coyle’s feats ranged generally higher and exceeded Moira, ranging from 0.19 to 0.27 all the way up to 0.66 tons of TNT, closing the gap down for Moira into a gap nearly 2.8x higher. While Moira would definitely lose in strength here, it’s very likely that Moira’s supports with Ultimates like Reaper that can exceed Overwatch higher tiers like Primal Winston who scales to Doomfist have the possibility to match Coyle in strength- however those are very short-term win conditions and statistic edges that simply wouldn’t matter in the long run. However, even if Moira could physically close the gap in strength, she has no way to circumvent Dr. Coyle’s sheer lifting strength advantage that could hold the potential to go up to a million tons.

If we were to be absolutely generous to Moira and offer her scaling to the highest ends of Overwatch, which is to the modified Titan Omnic’s railgun that busted through a building in one shot and punched open a skyscraper, placing her at 84 tons of TNT, Coyle being given the same kind of generosity for her feats and scaling would put her on par with Hedlok’s responsibility for the sky formations in their boss fight, getting her up to 1,480,000 tons of TNT (or 1.48 megatons, simply), putting Coyle nearly 18,000 times stronger than Moira. 


However, speed becomes much more interesting in this debate.Moira and Coyle generally reach similar numbers, having matching speeds for tens of meters per second, hundreds, etc. With Coyle, her comparison to Min Min puts her around 560 m/s, while Moira potentially got up to 800 m/s scaling to Tracer being able to tip-toe around gunfire. In addition, both had feats exceeding this, too, with Moira reaching up to 6,000 m/s to 8,055 m/s off of Tracer being able to dodge missiles and Coyle scaling to characters and she herself who can react to explosives reaching an average of 7,150 m/s. This puts the two in comparable speed routes, with Moira being either 1.15 times faster or slower give or take.


If you intended on being generous with Moira and giving her the ability to somehow have legitimate faster than light arguments, Coyle can match that with her own potential speed scaling with comparable leniency. Nonetheless, while both can get into similar ballparks, Coyle generally exceeds anything Moira has to offer with her own feats, overwhelming her in physical strength and matching her in speed no matter what would be given to Moira. 


Arsenal and Abilities

Both hold distinct arsenals, with Moira’s vast number of abilities she gets through her biotic energy and orbs which she can use all across the fight in many creative ways, alongside her coalescense. However, despite Moira’s distinct abilities, they could not stand in the mere shadow of Coyle’s massive arsenal, having over thirty different kinds of weapons which were generally unique, all of which allowed her to creatively play around Moira’s style of combat. This wasn’t even touching upon Coyle’s blocking abilities, allowing her to distinctly prevent incapacitation methods from being backfired onto her, or her invisibility which could allow her to match Moira’s Fade ability. However, none of this was as big of an edge as Rush mode offered, as it distinctly amplifies Coyle’s stats and weight, allowing her to absolutely overwhelm Moira with attacks she can’t deflect or play around.


 Plus, Coyle’s arsenal generally carries good counters to Moira’s arsenal besides being bigger. Moira’s orbs weren’t safe when they could be reflected back at her by Shield ARMS, for example, and a lot of Moira’s strongest abilities are very linear and generally more tunnel-sighted, while Coyle’s abilities constantly attack on all angles and would force Moira to pay more attention to her environment than focus on draining her opponent like how she normally does. Moira’s own arsenal isn’t bad, though, as Coyle hold no complete counter to Biotic Grasp, although the ability alone would be very unlikely to kill Coyle given its stat-based damage, or abilities like Coalescense that could support Moira and deal constant damage. Moira is, however, absolutely overwhelmed when you compare her to Coyle’s sheer arsenal in size and strength.   

Tertiary Factors

Generally, both are similar in their intelligence and smarts, performing very similar intelligence feats being some of the most impressive and first genetic manipulators to perform feats that no one else could replicate, with both being able to replicate one anothers feats like modifying the genetic structures of living beings or raising the dead. However, Coyle is a vastly more experienced combat who’s dedicated way more of her time to become the ‘strongest ARMS champion’, having been able to easily take down people like Max Brass with her hand-to-hand… ARM-to-ARM? Either way, both may be similar in intelligence, Coyle is way more combat experienced despite Moira’s Blackwatch experience. Another thing to note in their intelligence is that Coyle is likely a more intelligent creator, as while Moira likely made her own suit that can manipulate biotic energy on her own, Coyle has performed very similar things on her own accord creating Springtron, the Cell, Helix, and entire generations of ARMS monsters across her years of experience. Another premise to make here in context of these factors is that Moira is a far more risky combatant, especially when she drags her team into this situation. While she was seemingly a great Blackwatch operative, her Talon partners have constantly shown that they won’t always follow the guidelines of a mission besides Widowmaker, and others like Mauga have explicitly interfered with other teammates indirectly when going on their own way to deal with situations. Either way, this would be disastrous for Moira as a lot of her means to deal with Coyle’s other supports would come from her own, in that a lot of their means cancel out one another. In regards to actual teams, Moira likely has a stronger team granted her access to someone like Sombra who can shut down Springtron, Hedlok, and Coyle herself with their ARMS technology, however Sombra is the only thing that would prevent Coyle from taking over any of Moira’s teammates like Mauga or Reaper with Hedlok, and having Springtron or Master Mummy absolutely overwhelm Moira and the remaining teammates. With Mauga and Sombra displaying less-than-stellar teamwork and Sombra constantly wanting to work on her own to discover secrets, it’s possible that Moira’s supports could get sidetracked. However, a big point to be made is that Coyle can draw a lot less focus from her and allow her supports to potentially fight against Moira. While Moira is a frontline combatant who supports her team, Coyle doesn’t have to do much, and with her teammates enacting similar arsenal advantages to herself she wouldn’t need to much anyways. With this being likely in character with Coyle to stand by the side, it’s possible that Coyle could absolutely allow Moira to fall apart herself with her support should she not keep them together while overwhelming them with Cells and her own underlings before finishing the fight on her own accord when she unleashes her Rush mode after the chaos settles. With Coyle being a generally better combatant, she will almost always be observant and look for what the best course of action is to be. Moira has taken this idea, too, however she simply does not hold the issues Coyle would with an entirely subservient following and an overwhelming edge in most other regards.

Conclusion

“Humanity is shackled. I will find the key.”

Advantages:

  • Biotic Grasp cannot be reliably countered.

  • Self-healing strengthens long lasting survivability.

  • Has fought against large numbers before, so the Core isn’t a big issue.

  • Powerful support options against Coyle, such as Widowmaker or Sombra.

  • Can easily cleanse effects from Ice or Fire ARMS with Fade. 

Disadvantages:

  • Physically weaker and struggles against supports as a result.

  • Less subservient support who are willing to work on their own than with Moira.

  • Far more chaotic and risky gameplan when fighting alongside Talon support.

  • Less combat experienced.

  • Could be closed in on through Coyle’s range and directional attacks.

  • Electric attacks can disable abilities.


"Your. Worst. NIGHTMARE!"

Advantages:

  • Physically stronger.

  • Outnumbers easily with supports.

  • Larger arsenal and abilities.

  • Environmental control allows her to overwhelm Moira, such as deflecting her Biotic Orbs.

  • Support is much more subservient to her. 

  • More combat experienced.

  • Supports like Master Mummy or Springtron could easily take on and overwhelm Moira on their own.

  • Seemingly endless Cell units to draw from to overwhelm Moira.

Disadvantages:

  • No direct counters to Biotic Grasp.

  • No direct counters to Moira’s Coalescense, however able to match it with her own abilities..

  • No direct counters to Fade, however able to match it with her own abilities.


This debate was fascinating, taking both of these scientists at their best to combat one another through sheer intelligence and genetic engineering. However, if you watched closely, it was all over for Moira from the beginning.

Coyle took strength in every way, having a strength edge varying all the way between 205 times with Coyle’s skyscraper punch versus Widowmaker surviving a blow from Doomfist to a gap nearing 2.8 times when you compare their higher values between Coyle’s scaling to Hedlok and Moira’s Blackwatch combat experience with Talon brutes. With speed being generally even between both parties, there was no way Moira was going to be able to close that gap. Couple that with Moira’s chaotic Talon support and Coyle’s massive arsenal allowing her to shut off a number of cybernetics in Moira’s support side or Moira’s ability to support her team, alongside Coyle’s greater range and heavier blows, it was difficult for Moira to come out on top.

Even if you gave these two similar leniency for what they could scale to, Moira would never be able to match Hedlok’s potential sky changing feat, and speed would simply always parallel one another no matter what you could pull out for Moira. Should Moira take down the hundred Cells and Coyle’s subordinates, Coyle can always whip out another batch, and eventually Moira would have to face Coyle head-on. With the brickwall of stats the rad doctor held and the sheer barrier of Coyle’s arsenal, Moira had to surrender her will to the new queen of genetics, the greatest biologist, Dr. Coyle!



Conclusion

Dr. Coyle (2) - hades, DoRitto


Moira (1) -  𝓑𝓪𝓭𝓽𝓲𝓶𝓮32 (Pity vote)
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